RockSync?

[munkifisht]

Would the rb guys, or some1 else for that matter, be on to create a program that will
1- generate a database and update the database (not sure how this would work, but iRivium has it)
2- Sync files
3- re-sort music files function, as in, by artist etc all automatically and all with out a resync
4- update rb automatiacly (it is always annoying having to delete the folders to do the rb update)
5- rip music
6- if there were anyway to get some affilation with a music website, music downloads

A real good all rounder package program coupled with rb could really change the iRiver, I think anyway

[Febs]

Originally Posted by munkifisht

Would the rb guys, or some1 else for that matter, be on to create a program that will
1- generate a database and update the database (not sure how this would work, but iRivium has it)

This already exists, and I'm sure it will be refined.

4- update rb automatiacly (it is always annoying having to delete the folders to do the rb update)

Huh? Just download the latest daily build and unzip it directly to the root of your player. You don't need to delete anything. It takes me three mouse clicks and less than 45 seconds (which includes the download time) to update to the latest build.

5- rip music

Once again, "Huh?" Unless you could plug a CD drive into your H120, how would rockbox rip music? There are already a ton of quality programs that will rip music onto your computer. I don't see why the Rockbox developers would want to write another one.

6- if there were anyway to get some affilation with a music website, music downloads

Highly unlikely.

[jamesshuang]

I can tell you that on linux, either rhythmbox or amarok are EXCELLENT tag-based mp3 players. If you set their indexed directory to where your iriver mounts, it'll be exactly like itunes. Both are tied to cd-rippers, allowing to rip to ogg. Integration with an mp3 site will not happen, again because of legal issues- the only reason why itunes works with the industry (and they don't like it anyways) is because itunes uses DRM, something the iriver will never have with opensource programs.

BTW, all these attributes you listed almost perfectly describe an ipod. If the ipod suits your needs so well, why did you get an iriver then? My opinion is, with hardware, get what suits you. Ipod doesn't suit me, in fact, I hate it, because I hate DRM, I hate AAC, and I hate tag-based organizing. Iriver suits me well, because my music is more than 50% ogg (no stinkin' DRM either!), it's organized by subfolders, and it's not apple. That's why I like my iriver so much

[munkifisht]

Iplod, Ishod!!! no thanks! the suggestion here is to create a new program, and perhaps the ispiration is coming from iTunes, but I don't care, what I'm suggesting is an iRiver home, one program that does many tasks. A useability program, ok, its fine to download and install new versions of rb everyday, (and I know that where the release version comes out this will probably stop), but I thought it would be cool if you could do a whole lot more with your iRiver through you PC and have it all easily laid out and readdy to use. I mean, I can use rb, and get it going and stuff going on it no problem, but what about my fool of a girlfriend, or PC mook of a mother, there is no chance that these, ok, I'll say it, women, will have any chance, and while some women seem to be cheating and reading books to learn more about that big TV with the buzzy box that their husbands have brought home, most won't. Now obviously I'm talking the piss, but I think it would be cool if PC and tech novices had some chance of using rb, and it would make life delightful for the rest of us, and as for the 4 second update thing, why is it not 1 second, just click a button, and there you go, it updates.

[jamesshuang]

Maybe I'll look into something like that... but keep in mind, I'm a linux user, so I'll probably make something GTK-based

[pomegranate]

What I would really, really kill for on my iRiver (and I shamelessly admit this is a rip from the iTunes/iPod system, it's a useful function) is a program which lists all of the music on your computer, and you can select, by checking/unchecking or moving onto/removing from a list. The program will then automaticaly add the music to your player or delete it appropriately. The reason I want this function is that my computer has more than three times as much music than my iHP holds.
I like to use the full capacity of my player, but this means that when I want to add something new, I have to go through the tedium of going through My Computer, going to my player, navigating through folders, deleting songs, then going to another, until I've got enough space. Then I have to open up the Music folder on my computer and copy the wanted music into the appropriate Genre folders on my player. This is really f**cking tedious!
Additionally I would like the program to automatically sync newly downloaded podcasts, and delete ones that I've listened to or are over a week old.
And then the app will automatically update the tag DB for all added and removed content.

Those of you who think these functions are wanting to turn the iRiver into an iPod, please put a sock in it. iPod has some functional advantages over the iHP, and vice versa. I want the best of both worlds.

[omri]

am going to start a sourceforge project next week for a winamp iriver sync plugin
see how it goas
its going to be writen in C++ or VB
didnt deside yet
it will sync with the media library

[pomegranate]

But what will that syncing consist of exactly, omri? Will it just stick everything in Winamp onto the player? How will it arrange the files? Will it generate a database?

Sorry to ask so many questions, but I wouldn't want you to waste your time be repeating work that has been done before. Good luck anyway...

[rd]

I think you could basically do what you want with J River Media Center, pomegranate.

[pomegranate]

I'm not too sure about that RD, I've tried J River a few times and it always seems to fall short, in ways that are critical for what I want. But maybe things have changed since I used it last, so to clarify:
1. Can you choose which songs from your computer to be put on your player?
2. If you 'un-choose' songs, does it delete them from the player?
3. Does it build the tag DB, and update it when songs are added or removed?
4. Does it do this stuff automatically when you connect the player?

If the answer to many of the above is no then, sorry but it doesn't do what I want, as was my experience last time I tried it.

A further problem is that I'm guessing that, if J River does build a DB, it will be for the official iRiver firmware, which as absolutely unusable for DB browsing. I'd hope it was pretty clear that I was talking about a prog that will do all the above, to work with Rockbox.

[rd]

Of course, you're right. It obviously doesn't make the rockbox tag database.

Media Center was just a thought I had. I just recently started using it I would guess that it does 1 and 2 but I haven't had time to test. It's free to download a trial version if you're interested. Media Center 11 has been updated significantly from previous versions.

As for your ideal desktop tool. I've been thinking about it as well. It rarely gets discussed how superior the ipod/itunes is in terms of syncing, playlisting, and overall ease of music management. After all, besides portability the real advantage of digital music is to allow the user powerful control over the organization of his music. Playing through a bunch of album folders with shuffle isn't really using the digital medium to its potential. I think apple understood this better than most other companies.

I would like to see a desktop companion that
1. Creates folder navigation based on ID3 tags
2. Creates the rockbox database.
3. Stores song ratings and can sync them with rockbox.
4. Can build playlists/sync commands based on playcount, ratings, other playlists, ID3 tags. <see smartplaylists.com>
5. Can add/remove files from the DAP based on their rating.
You could use "1" to mean 'remove from DAP and don't add
again during sync'.
6. Calculate the storage space used by the songs on your computer
that will be synced so that the user can rate songs "1" until
the storage matches 20gb, 40gb etc.

I think ripping music, music playback, and online music access are better left to Winamp, Itunes, Media Center, foobar etc.

I think this program could come from the following:
1. The developer of TDT
- TDT already does many of the things listed above. just not with rockbox. I don't know if he has a 100 series though. Perhaps he has no access to rockbox at this point. However, maybe there's a rockbox user with skill enough to convert his code for use with the rockbox tag database, playcount, and ratings.
2. The Rockbox team
- probably not the best use of their time. there's plenty of pure dap work to be done. this is probably a better project for someone with more software skill than firmware skill.
3. Red Chair Irivium
- I'm not sure the rockbox user # is high enough for them to take interest but you never know unless you ask.
4. J River Media Center
- They've shown some willingness to interface with different DAPs. I think they are still trying hard to build a core user base for their product. If the rockbox community showed enough interest they may be willing to help integrate it into Media Center.
5. Other
- If someone can make TDT there's really no reason the a Rockbox equivalent can't be made.

[munkifisht]

I think TDT is great, but it does lack a certian functionality, as in it's ease of use. And I think that iRivium is great, but it is not flexabile enough for my likings, trying to setup your folder structure is a prime example. I also like TGF, but it is sometimes clumbersome to use. I think tat rd is right, it would be a waste of anyone time who is working on rb, and it is probably a waste of anyones time to work on it now anyway, since rb is not finalised, but some new program were to be devloped, I think it would be in everyone intrest to keep the project opensource, and to work with the rb team to devlop it properly. If something does start to happen, I think I would enjoy getting involved.

[rd]

Well, I began to test the JRiver Media Center 11 last night.
Apparently, it really only recognizes the IHP as an external hard drive.
I haven't yet figured out how it deals with the PC music > DAP music problem; maybe not at all.
I don't think it has a checkbox system like pomegranate was explaining. I think, however, that you may be able to create a playlist that is used to provide a list of files to transfer PC --> computer. Will provide more info as I test.

Can you provide more detail about the areas where Irivium is deficient, munkifisht?

[meowsqueak]

Originally Posted by munkifisht

what I'm suggesting is an iRiver home, one program that does many tasks.

Originally Posted by jamesshuang

Maybe I'll look into something like that... but keep in mind, I'm a linux user, so I'll probably make something GTK-based

Just a thought - the Unix Philosophy recommends, when practical, writing programs that "do one thing, and do them well". While I have nothing against a well written program that has many features, it's easier (and more robust) to design little back-end programs that perform each task and 'glue' them together with a nice (GUI perhaps) front-end. From the users' point of view it looks like a single app, but behind the scenes it's far more flexible, has a much better design, and is probably ultimately faster to develop. That's been my experience anyway. I wish more Windows programs were developed in this manner - we'd have a much better library of software on that platform.

[omri]

what i thoght is do some kind of
artist\album folder style
then the titles

and maybe combine it with the rockbox DB builder plugin thats allready there
am perty sure i can find a sync algorighem someware as well
then its just
mash them together into one good total plugin

[munkifisht]

Originally Posted by meowsqueak

Just a thought - the Unix Philosophy recommends, when practical, writing programs that "do one thing, and do them well". While I have nothing against a well written program that has many features, it's easier (and more robust) to design little back-end programs that perform each task and 'glue' them together with a nice (GUI perhaps) front-end. From the users' point of view it looks like a single app, but behind the scenes it's far more flexible, has a much better design, and is probably ultimately faster to develop. That's been my experience anyway. I wish more Windows programs were developed in this manner - we'd have a much better library of software on that platform.

I quite agree, but I also think there should be a GUI to these programs, a lanucher. None would need any other, although, mabey that could be so in the future, all programs would be independent from one another, infact, I can't think of a reason that they should work together.