IHP-1** - more bugs / more serious bugs than other players?

[Northern_Dragon]

Hello everybody!

I've been spending a lot of time researching MP3 players to determine which will suit me best (nope, I don't have an iRiver - yet).

I have to say having read various reports forum posts at various sites and so on I was leaning towards the iRiver IHP-120 or upcoming 140.

That is before I started concentrating my research on the iRiver, which lead me to this forum and the iRiver community forum. Bizarely having read the posts in these forums, which a populated largely by existing owners, I find myself rethinking because of the number of threads focussing on bugs.

The thread on who ditched an ipod is therefore something of a breath of fresh air! It's so nice to hear comments of satisfaction with the iRiver rather than complaints about bugs, particularly when it is, in comparison difficult to find consistently repeated "complaints" about other players - particularly the ipod (opinions are just too polarised). i.e. proper bugs rather than individual and isolated problems.

I'd be very interested to hear if anyone knows about any further issues/bugs with the competition - as objective as possible please, (I doubt I could ask this kind of question in the ipodlounge!!)

[Adam]

I ditched my iPod to get an iHP-120, and it was an extremely good decision, I have not looked back at all. Now, some of the things that made me do this are:

The iPod gets damaged so easily (scratches), and cases to stop that cost money, big money. Not so on the iHP.

I posted a couple of threads on iPodlounge about this very topic. It was quite amusing, while everybody seemed to hate me for the idea's that I brought up, but couldn't actually have an answer for any of them.

Read up:

http://www.ipodlounge.com/forums/sho...threadid=19230

http://www.ipodlounge.com/forums/sho...threadid=19419

The only other player I would have considered is the Rio Karma, but I didn't know about it at the time (and here in Aussie, they're non-existant), so also have a look into that.

[coreman]

The bugs are well defined...what has me and many others upset is that iRiver has shown zero interest in communicating with their customer base on when or how the bugs will be resolved.

My suggestion would be to hold off buying for a couple of weeks (I know it will be tough) and see if anything changes here or on the IF. You will get the straight scoop here...

I think everyone agrees that the -120 is a terrific player with some problems...some are major for some people (shuffle mode is how I listen to my 2K tracks so lack is a major problem) and minor for others (I don't record concerts so lack of volume control is minor issue now).

However IF (the $400 question) iRiver successfully fixes the shuffle and addresses the others (on the fly playlists, volume control, resume, gapless OGG, cross fading), it will be the PREMIERE player, bar none.... all of the requested features are eminently doable, just a question of whether or not iRiver wants to tackle them "for free", meaning free firmware upgrades... :P

This is where I am beginning to think iRiver is heading, they realize they have a terrific player in principle and so maybe all of the new features should be "options" rather than free upgrades....(my paranoia is growing each day that iRiver doesn't respond! )

My suggestion still holds though...wait a few weeks and see how this soap opera plays out...if it isn't resolved by end of January, it isn't likely to be resolved any time soon...

[Adam]

Oh, also, if you think that the firmware situation for the iHP is not so good, it is absolutely pitiful on the iPod.

[slaine]

IMO, there are only two HDD players in the market I would consider buying. After extensive research of all mp3 HDD players on the market today, my conclusion is that there isn't one that is perfect. They ALL have problems and deficiencies in some form or other! Even the Rio Karma, which basically only allows you to copy songs via its on interface, and worst of all, it is NOT a universal mass storage device. iPOD also has deficiencies (lack of battery life, flimsy construction, stupid iTunes or Musicmatch software, much more lacking in features like recording and FM tuner).

Of the two HDD mp3 players in the market, one of my choices is the neuros mp3 player (http://www.neurosaudio.com/), and the other one is the iHP-1xx series of players (of which I am an owner of a iHP-120).

My reason for saying this that notwithstanding the firmware issues, they are the most full featured mp3 players with the most flexibility and potential. Both are universal mass storage devices, both have FM radio, both offer recording option. Neuros even has FM transmitter and FM recording with NO problems. However, neuros mp3 player also has interface and functionality problems. The worst problem is that I am a lazy git and I hate IDv3 tags. And with neuros, although you can transfer any file u like and use it like mass storage device, it will only recognise songs if you use its database software. This is like having the iHP-120 with ONLY database mode and no file/tree mode.

The only reason I bought iHP-1xx is that of all the players I had ready access to, it was the best. I was simply not willing to ship a unit from US, and also the drag, drop and play without mucking with DB functionality was the final push towards the iRiver.

However, if you don't mind using a database manager and all your music is already nicely tagged, and you live in North America, I would recommend you go to the neuros site and check out the player. Best of all, their support forums are ACTIVELY SUPPORTED by the neuros support staff! Amazing isn't it? Bear in mind that neuros mp3 player also has its own idiosyncracies and interface problems. Check out their forums and check if any of them are actual deal breakers for you!

The final consideration is something I only recently found out, and it's that iRiver is now a M$oft shop, and if I knew that, I would have stayed well away from iRiver. Just this factor alone is enough that if I had to remake my purchase decision, I would have gone through the hassle of shipping a neuros unit from US or Canada. The moment iRiver starts producing firmware that creates some sort of DRM nightmare, I will stop upgrading the firmware.

My final thoughts are that neuros>iRiver> everything else in market, but ultimately it is a matter of your own personal choices and preferences as to which features you find the most important, and which problems you simply cannot live with.

DISCLAIMER:

1) I neither work for iRiver nor Neuros Audio.
2) Notwithstanding my dislike of M$, I am a reasonably happy owner of an iRiver iHP-120 and still think it was a good buy

[coreman]

Originally Posted by Adam

Oh, also, if you think that the firmware situation for the iHP is not so good, it is absolutely pitiful on the iPod.

The issue isn't whether or not the iPod has bad firmware, it is whether or not iRiver will actively support ours....we all own iHP so I don't give a hoot what Apple or others do...at least not until the next time I am in the market for a player. I made my decision last October and wasn't satisfied with the -120 until today...

I am still quite unhappy with iRiver but time is the great healer...so let's see what transpires over the next couple of months...particularl y after the iHP-300 comes out in April...we'll see how well they support the "old" technology players like ours.

I am not impressed to this point with their service so I don't hold out much for a lot of new features on our players...I hope I am wrong... that is why the Ennis project is still very important and relevent to this forum.

[Northern_Dragon]

Thanks for the replies people, I'm considering the Rio Karma however it seems far less flexible than the iRiver, i.e. limited format support and not universal storage which is kind of a biggie really.

Thanks for the info on the Neuros Audio looks pretty interesting, good prices! Intergrated FM transmittor is a nice feature, illegal to use in the UK though! Will look at the reviews and reported bugs in that one. What are the interface / functionality problems?

Have to say my main issue with the iRiver is the apparent unresponsiveness of iRiver, what are they playing at??!!

Would be interesting to try to do a poll of what current iRiver users "fix" priorities are. I'd have a go at this myself but since I'm new to this forum and am not that familiar with the iRiver (cos I don't have one ).

[slaine]

Originally Posted by Northern_Dragon

Thanks for the info on the Neuros Audio looks pretty interesting, good prices! Intergrated FM transmittor is a nice feature, illegal to use in the UK though! Will look at the reviews and reported bugs in that one. What are the interface / functionality problems?

One of the problems is that ogg is not *fully* supported yet. Apparently high bitrate oggs will cause some skipping.

Also, the unit doesn't have a resume function on startup, so everytime you turn the unit off and on, you have to scroll to the playlist/file you want and get the player to play it!

That's about two of the problems I heard about some months ago.

Positive point is that they're currently completely rewriting their firmware to make it fully multi-tasking. This is something I don't believe is the case with iRiver's products because according to the recording guys on the international forums, the iRiver will actually miss a few milliseconds every time it does a write to the HDD! This really sucks as it totally invalidates the use of iRiver for any (semi)serious recording work.

On another note, it looks like they have (nearly) sold out their current hardware, and will be releasing their new players in february. So you may/may not be able to place on order for it anyway.

I'm actually quite disappointed with the state of HDD mp3 players, because it looks like every single company without exception is really releasing beta firmware/hardware without proper QA. The question is really which defect you would prefer to have, and how much support you can expect. For iRiver, I would say that they have just barely managed to get their firmware to an acceptable state with their recent 1.40 firmware.

[Northern_Dragon]

Thanks for the reply Slaine.

Having read a bit more and in light of the iRiver's latest firmware update it looks like this is the best option - despite its remaining faults.

The inflexibility and fewer features of the Karma compared to the iRiver rule that out. I have to say I was rather put off the Neuros just because of the size (about twice the size of the iRiver!!) that combined with the issues highlighted by you, Slaine, make the iRiver preferable again.

I'm still concerned about the lack of communication from (and slow action of) iRiver, but hey it could be worse and it could get better..

I'm going to wait a bit though see what happens with the IHP-140, particularly with regard to price.

[slaine]

Originally Posted by Northern_Dragon

Thanks for the reply Slaine.

Having read a bit more and in light of the iRiver's latest firmware update it looks like this is the best option - despite its remaining faults.

The inflexibility and fewer features of the Karma compared to the iRiver rule that out. I have to say I was rather put off the Neuros just because of the size (about twice the size of the iRiver!!) that combined with the issues highlighted by you, Slaine, make the iRiver preferable again.

I'm still concerned about the lack of communication from (and slow action of) iRiver, but hey it could be worse and it could get better..

I'm going to wait a bit though see what happens with the IHP-140, particularly with regard to price.

Yes, the most worrying thing is that their support is seriously non-existant. I have used the web based technical support form, and also emailed their customer support about why the display on my iHP-120 occassionally just goes blank, and after 3 days, I have not had any reply from them yet!

Considering the fact that I bought the mp3 player while I was in Hong Kong, and I am now in Australia, it is very worrying that the customer support simply does not reply to people at all.

Anyway, waiting is always a good idea, iRiver might get a clue, and pigs might fly. It's a real pity that such a great product could be so let down by the service and supprt people!